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100. Christian Ethics and Stateless Societies: The Anarchist Approach of the Perry Family

In the 100th episode of the podcast, host Craig Harguess is joined by guests Sarah and Jeff Perry from Voluntaryism in Action for a captivating exploration into the confluence of Christian values and the philosophy of anarchy. This milestone episode delves into the nuances of Christian Anarchism and Voluntarism, examining the personal metamorphoses that steer individuals away from traditional political paradigms toward a life of voluntary statelessness underpinned by faith. 

Throughout the episode, Sarah and Jeff Perry share the hurdles encountered in seeking a like-minded community and the challenges a society deeply ingrained with state-oriented ideologies poses. They shed light on the essence of fellowship and kinship, even in the digital sphere, for those who perceive themselves as misfits in a world unprepared for such radical ideas. The conversation also touches on the difficulty of communicating complex ideas over social media and the importance of giving people grace and meeting them where they are, as they were once in a similar position. The group emphasizes that the people they may joke about now were once reflections of their past selves, highlighting the transformative journey that led them to their current ideological stance. 

Taking an unexpected detour, the discussion ventures into the rustic world of homesteading, contrasting the merits of duck and chicken eggs and unpacking the symbolism it holds for Christian anarchists. This segment uncovers the layers of self-reliance and philosophical maturation, accompanied by a narrative of Jeff’s military service and how he underwent a profound ideological shift towards anarchism. 

The episode critically addresses the contentious interpretation of Romans 13 from an anarchist perspective, scrutinizing the alignment—or lack thereof—between modern democratic establishments and the teachings of Jesus. The discourse celebrates the significance of genuine leadership as demonstrated by Jesus, compared to the forceful rule often exhibited by earthly authorities. 

The discussion also spotlights the impactful initiatives of Voluntaryism in Action, emphasizing the human connections nurtured through voluntary charity. This starkly contrasts the impersonal touch of institutionalized aid, underscoring the human and spiritual dimensions of giving.

 Listeners are treated to a blend of humor, social commentary, and personal anecdotes that exemplify the intertwining of Christianity's core tenets with the principles of voluntaryism. As the 100th episode of the podcast, this thought-provoking journey offers an inspiring vision of community, support, and voluntary action shaped by love, grace, understanding, and Christian values.

Connect with the Perrys:

Website

Podcast: Voluntary View on Spotify, iTunes, Youtube

Key Moments:

00:02 Exploring Christian Anarchism and Voluntaryism

• Introduction to the intersection of Christianity and statelessness.

• Personal journeys from conventional politics to stateless existence based on Christian values.

• Importance of community, even if primarily online.

01:11 The Reach of the Bad Roman

• Discussion on the international reach of the podcast.

• Personal reflections on discovering Christian Anarchy.

• Surprise at finding a community with similar beliefs.

09:08 Duck Eggs and Freshly Laid Eggs

• Discussion on homesteading, duck vs. chicken eggs.

• Nutritional content and taste comparison.

• Personal anecdotes about self-sufficiency and philosophical evolution.

15:22 - Military Transition to Anarchism & Non-Judgmental Dialogue

• A former military medical officer's ideological shift towards anarchism.

• Impact of literature and libertarian thought on worldview.

• Emphasis on non-judgmental engagement within the anarchist community.

23:13 Christian Anarchism and the Bad Project

• Craig's journey from neoconservatism to Christian anarchism.

• Misconceptions about Christian Anarchy clarified.

• Sharing personal revelations about faith and statelessness.

26:41 Facebook Thread Drama and Miscommunication

• Addressing miscommunication and drama in a Facebook thread.

• Emphasis on understanding different perspectives within anarchism.

30:05 Understanding Anarchy and Romans 13 (11 Minutes)

• Interpretation of Romans 13 in the context of Christian anarchy.

• Biblical examples of resistance to secular authorities.

• Addressing objections related to submission to governing authorities.

33:57 Not Voting and Complaining About Government

• Discussion on Craig's decision not to vote and its implications.

• The counterintuitive nature of the argument that non-voters cannot complain.

38:41 Voluntarism and Anarchy

• Explanation of voluntarism as a subset of anarchy.

• Voluntarism focuses on voluntary interactions without coercion.

41:22 Religion, Government, and Accountability

• Differences between authority figures and authoritarianism.

• Critique of representative democracy and accountability.

• Reflection on the role of law enforcement and early church teachings.

49:57 Christian Anarchism and Voluntaryism Action

• Exploration of how Voluntaryism in Action embodies Christian Anarchist principles.

• Discussion on the organization's initiatives and community impact.

• Tension between Christianity and statism in church settings.

• Discomfort with nationalistic practices in worship.

• Early Christian teachings versus modern interpretations post-Constantine.

55:42 Voluntaryism

• Origins and evolution of a charitable organization, Voluntaryism in Action.

• Challenges and misconceptions surrounding non-profit work.

• Importance of voluntary giving and the impact of government programs on charity.

57:07 Obtaining & Maintaining 501(c)3 Status

• The process and challenges of obtaining 501(c)3 status for the organization.

• Insights into maintaining non-profit status and its importance.

01:04:18 Voluntaryism in Action

• Celebration of the work and achievements of Voluntaryism in Action.

• Personal anecdotes that underscore the organization's ethos.

01:09:36 Discussion on Voluntaryism in Action

• Impactful work of Voluntaryism in Action aligned with Christian values.

• Encouragement for listener support through donations or involvement.

• Challenges of social media censorship.

01:11:39 Twitter Campaigns and Content Restrictions

• Addressing the impact of content restrictions on social media campaigns.

• The organization's approach to creating and sharing provocative content.

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99. God's Country or Jesus’s Kingdom? Navigating the Nexus of Nationalism and Faith in America

Could the intertwining of faith and state authority be warping the very soul of Christianity? Unlock the complexities of Christian nationalism as we sit down for a round table to dissect the idolatrous juxtaposition of faith and governance. This episode dissects the potential hazards of conflating faith with state authority and how this can distort genuine religious practice and the core tenets of Christianity itself.

Join your host, Craig Harguess, along with friends of the show Chris Polk, Cody Cook, Paul Parayil, and Darren Freidinger, who help us peel back the layers of entanglement to reveal the true call of Faith. Witness a bold examination of Christian nationalism's historical claims and current implications in the realm of politics and social justice. 

As echoes of January 6th reverberate through the national consciousness, we scrutinize its portrayal as a Christian nationalist insurrection and the subsequent impact on political landscapes. The breach, the media's narrative, and the political fallout are dissected with a critical lens, contrasting the motives behind these actions with the broader implications for American society. We confront the seductive pull of cultural identity and the struggle to prioritize important global issues over trivial cultural squabbles. 

Through this dialogue, we strive to foster a deeper understanding of how a desire for a 'Christian nation' impacts both the spiritual body of Christ and our broader societal fabric. With a laid-back yet critical approach, we discuss the importance of curiosity and questioning in religious communities, advocating for meaningful action against social injustices rather than getting lost in cultural distractions. The panel lays out a thought-provoking journey through the contradictions of Christian nationalism, inviting you to reflect, question, and expand your understanding of faith in the public square.

The digital age has transformed the battleground of ideas, and we explore the challenges of engaging in meaningful discourse on social media amid generational technology. As we draw to a close, we advocate for deeper awareness and action, urging listeners not to be sidetracked by fleeting controversies but to remain steadfast in the pursuit of no king but Christ. Tune in for a thought-provoking journey through the contradictions and complexities of Christian nationalism.

Key Moments:

01:20 Christian Nationalism and Its Contradictions

  • Christianity Today Article: What Is Christian Nationalism?

  • Critiqued for distorting religious practice and undermining Christian principles.

  • Enforcement of state authority is a key concern.

05:11 Christian Nationalism and the New Covenant

  • Inconsistencies with Jesus' teachings are highlighted.

  • Cherry-picking from the Old Testament discussed with guest Cody Cook.

15:20 Christian Nationalism and State Role

  • Examination of Christian nationalism and its contrast with a kingdom culture mindset.

  • Emphasis on the spiritual body of Christ over earthly rulers.

27:52 The Impact of Christian Nationalism

  • Growth of the church during persecution discussed.

  • Detachment from state affairs, detrimental effects, and pitfalls of striving for a "Christian nation."

33:13 January 6th and Christian Nationalism Discussion

  • Discussion on the Capitol breach on January 6th.

  • Examination of Christian nationalism, media portrayal, politicians' response, and intentions vs. implications of actions.

43:54 Exploring Christian Nationalism in Politics

  • Aftermath of January 6th discussed.

  • Accusations of Christian nationalism, manipulation by agencies, spectrum of ideologies, and complex relationship between American and Christian identities.

58:49 Challenges of Social Media Discourse

  • Christian nationalism debates on social media.

  • Generational gap in technology use, lack of curiosity in education and religion, and strategy for online discourse.

01:08:32 Christian Nationalism and Cultural Identity

  • American democracy's defense of Anglo-Protestant culture discussed.

  • Exclusion of Catholics and Orthodox believers, trivial cultural controversies distracting from pressing social injustices.

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31. Christians and Muslims Breaking Bread with Peace Catalyst

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On this episode, Craig and Abby Cleckner talk with Keith Giles and Becca from the Peace Catalyst Podcast. The Peace Catalyst is an organization that is committed to fostering understanding, reconciliation, and peace between Christians and Muslims. Jesus was the Prince of Peace, and as Christians we should be constantly striving to live a life of peace and love towards others, especially those with differing beliefs or culture than ours. Because of the political narrative, driven by the media, American Christians have been misled and taught to hate and fear those who we don’t understand. The Peace Catalyst helps to foster conversation and relationship, which in turn, help to bring an understanding of the humanity and dignity of others we may currently see as different. 

LINKS & STARTING POINTS:

2:45 Becca’s background 

  • working with Peace Catalyst for 2 years

  • was looking for a faith based peacebuilding avenue 

6:10 Keith’s history with Peace Catalyst

  • got involved in Peace Catalyst about 1 ½ ago

  • first involvement was a Peace Feast

  • Martin Brooks: Director of Peace Catalyst 

10:09 Becca: burdened to help facilitate peace between Christians and Muslims

  • Israel/Palestine

  • while in college developed a deeper understanding of the Middle East and the conflict between Israel and Palestine 

  • grew up in a pro Israel environment 

  • while in Jordan developed a deeper understanding of the Middle East 

  • connected with others who have a heart for peace 

  • wanted to participate in restoring Shalom 

  • push back from people who don’t have a holistic view of the situation and don’t understand the many factors at play 

15:38 Peace Catalyst 

  • proponent of loving everyone, regardless of race or religious affiliation 

  • facilitate reconciliation 

  • remind and educate Christians about their ministry of reconciliation

18:01 American Christians have bought into a false ideas 

  • “they hate us for our freedoms” 

  • the truth is not the story as it has been told and presented to us by media and those with political interest in the narrative

  • the way to break down barriers is by sitting down and talking to the “other side”

  • listen to their story to build empathy 

  • “I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.” Mahatma Gandhi 

  • Christian Tribalism 

  • it is not black and white, good guys vs. bad guys

25:40 Three Stages of Peace 

  • Stage One - Understanding 

  • Stage Two - Connecting

  • Stage Three - Collaborating

  • American Christians don’t realize that most Muslims condemn 9/11 and violent extremist/terrorist (just like they do) 

32:05 Are people afraid to be wrong? 

  • politics and media are used to instil fear and misconception 

  • we don’t have to believe the same thing in order to respect each other’s dignity as fellow human beings

  • it’s ok to disagree 

  • fear is heretics 

  • we act as if Christianity had all the correct information about God 

  • the Gospel is not about information, it is about transformation 

  • if you are going to follow Christ you are called to love your neighbor 

  • move away from the need for certainty 

  • move away from fear, move towards love

  • Romans 12, transformed by the renewing of your mind 

  • you are closer to God when you are asking questions, than when you have it all figured out 

44:20 Peace Catalyst started by Rick Love

  • he also started Evengelicals for Peace 

  • the goal is fostering peace between Muslims and Christians and bringing peace to our communities 

  • how can we work together as a community 

  • why and how Christians should engage in peace building 

48:42 Plugs 

28. The American Church’s Political Obsession with Scott Arnold

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Many Christians in the United States are outspoken about their desires for Christian men and women to obtain political power and influence. The stance is that religious freedoms need to be protected, but is forcing morality on the people through legislation an effective way to spread the gospel?  Could Christians be doing more harm than good in their efforts?

Scott Arnold is the author of the article Winning the Battle, But Losing the War: The American Church’s Political Obsession.  In this episode, Craig talks with Scott about his transition from a world of conservative, Christian, and redline Republican upbringing into one of Christain Anarchy. They explore how the gospel message can be destroyed or damaged by using politics to force a Christian agenda. Scott also explains his involvement with Steiger International, whose mission is to impact the global youth culture and make the gospel relevant. This is a thought-provoking episode for any Christian who has been of the mindset that Christians need to use politics to further their agenda or force their morality on others. 


Timestamps and starting points:

1:27 Scott’s Background

  • Grew up in the conservative Christian republican culture 

  • majored in pastoral ministries 

  • currently lives in northeast Georgia 

4:04 How Scott found The Bad Roman

8:04 Learning about anarchy 

11:35 Discussing Scott’s article: Winning the Battle, but Losing the War: The American Church’s Political Obsession

  • Christians equate increased political power with increased influence

  • When bringing the gospel into the political realm pieces are lost 

  • Abortion and the messy art of law making

  • using politics to force Christian values on others

  • using the government to control morals 

  • outsource morality to the state

  • the state is not, and cannot be, Christian

  • Myth of Christain Nation

26:25 What is the endgame in winning this war?

  • Best case: Christian religious freedom and comfortability 

  • worst case: suppression of all other philosophies 

  • is it really religious freedom Christians are fighting for?

  • prayer in school 

43:05 Polish Woodstock

Scott’s Plugs: